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BBC Horizon: Lost Pyramids of Caral
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The magnificent ancient city of pyramids at Caral in Peru hit the headlines in 2001. The site is a thousand years older than the earliest known civilization in the Americas and, at 2,627 BC, is as old as the pyramids of Egypt. RT 49:03.
Aug 2, 2007 6:43 AM
Re: BBC Horizon: Lost Pyramids of Caral
i really enjoy these. are they broadcast in the u.s. on any cable or satelite stations?
Re: BBC Horizon: Lost Pyramids of Caral
An occasional one on BBC America (which I get at home, though it shares a channel with something amazingly dull). I believe that one of the Discovery properties also shows/used to at one point.
I agree that just the manner in which the shows are presented is engaging and entertaining. Who needs Hollywood?
I agree that just the manner in which the shows are presented is engaging and entertaining. Who needs Hollywood?
By: spam_vigilante
Re: BBC Horizon: Lost Pyramids of Caral
This is indeed a very good and quiet accurate documentation. Just one little thing: The program makes it look like the process of urbanization just happened in a blink of an eye. Infact it was still a rather long process of about 4.000 years (at least in the mesopotamian region, which I know best) and started not six, but ten thousand years from today. Of course 4.000 years is still a very short period of time compared to the stone age which took place before the so called "neolithic (r)evolution" when people discovered agriculture and pottery. But there wasn't a guy who decided:" Hey, let's clime off our trees and build up a monumental society." It took time.
Besides this is really interesting stuff, especially because it shows that innovation in mankind is not always driven by aggression. Unfortunately there are many archeological sites all around the world (like Catal Huyuk, Nevali Cori, and later Ur and Uruk), even from older times than Caral, that show that war was infact always one of the essential motivations of the human race.
Besides this is really interesting stuff, especially because it shows that innovation in mankind is not always driven by aggression. Unfortunately there are many archeological sites all around the world (like Catal Huyuk, Nevali Cori, and later Ur and Uruk), even from older times than Caral, that show that war was infact always one of the essential motivations of the human race.
By: azuray
Re: BBC Horizon: Lost Pyramids of Caral
>> war was infact always one of the essential motivations of the human race.
One of the great paradoxes of life. Of course, we've now learned that many forests cannot survive without fire. Destruction may very much be necessary to beget anew.
One of the great paradoxes of life. Of course, we've now learned that many forests cannot survive without fire. Destruction may very much be necessary to beget anew.
By: spam_vigilante
Re: BBC Horizon: Lost Pyramids of Caral
>> many forests cannot survive without fire.
Let's just hope that mankind will learn to use innovation for preserving the world around it rather than burning it down. To stay in the archeological context: Best example for how fatal it can be to destroy his own environment are Easter Islands. They used all their wood to build their gifts for the gods and finally starved to death because of that. Not so smart.
Let's just hope that mankind will learn to use innovation for preserving the world around it rather than burning it down. To stay in the archeological context: Best example for how fatal it can be to destroy his own environment are Easter Islands. They used all their wood to build their gifts for the gods and finally starved to death because of that. Not so smart.
By: azuray
Re: BBC Horizon: Lost Pyramids of Caral
Is spewing noxious chemicals into the air we breathe any smarter? Though somewhat of a fatalist attitude, humans puff their chests out at their great achievements when in fact, we've done nothing but scar this planet.
By: spam_vigilante
Re: BBC Horizon: Lost Pyramids of Caral
Indeed a fatalist attitude, but I share your point here. As always in life it seems like the right way is somewhere in the middle of all that. I could discuss this endlessly, but I got to go to bed now. ;)
By: azuray
Re: BBC Horizon: Lost Pyramids of Caral
I agree. An extraordinary documentary, yet constrained by time limitations. More than a show like this, we need a SERIES, Cosmos-style, to touch upon this incredibly important and fascinating subject.
Case in point, which you mentioned, Catal Huyuk. For 6000 years did this city of over 5000 people exist, without fortifications, and there is not a single sign of warfare, no spears, no arrowheads, nothing. As an interesting factoid, the artistic style of Catal Huyuk seems to have passed over to the Minoan civilization, which indicates a great possibility that Minoa and Catal Huyuk are one and the same people.
Finally, a theory goes that mankind lived for tens of thousands of years as a great community of psylocibin takers, but when the climate changed and the mushroom supply began to run out, they took to storing for the dry season in honey, which ferments, and so, the mushroom culture became the mead culture, prone to "paternal attitudes" such as warfare, slavery, etc.
My point is, how I would love a comprehensive view of all these things in one grand, ten episode (at least) series.
Case in point, which you mentioned, Catal Huyuk. For 6000 years did this city of over 5000 people exist, without fortifications, and there is not a single sign of warfare, no spears, no arrowheads, nothing. As an interesting factoid, the artistic style of Catal Huyuk seems to have passed over to the Minoan civilization, which indicates a great possibility that Minoa and Catal Huyuk are one and the same people.
Finally, a theory goes that mankind lived for tens of thousands of years as a great community of psylocibin takers, but when the climate changed and the mushroom supply began to run out, they took to storing for the dry season in honey, which ferments, and so, the mushroom culture became the mead culture, prone to "paternal attitudes" such as warfare, slavery, etc.
My point is, how I would love a comprehensive view of all these things in one grand, ten episode (at least) series.
Re: BBC Horizon: Lost Pyramids of Caral
I'm not sure whether the absence of fortifications is a sign for a peaceful community. Infact, at least in the settlement of Jericho, with was almost contemporary to Catal Huyuk, there was a city wall. Plus, they found quite a number of obsidian arrow heads and knifelike tools in the burials (see http://flickr.com/photos/catalhoyuk/page5/). Also, the hunters showed in the wall paintings had spears and bows, so weapons weren't completely unknown to them. And as a highly unarcheological sidenote, I am pretty sure, when more then two people have weapons, they sometimes use them against each other. ;)
As to the "Catal-Minoa"-problem: As alluring as it is to see parallels in the worshipping of bull-like figures, between Catal Huyuk and the first relevant minoan bull figurines lie almost 3000 years. It's highly improbable that the people of Catal just disappered and reappear after so much time. The sign of bull horns was a very popular element in the art of the whole mesopotamian area from the 7. to the 2. millenium b.c. Almost every sumarian temple in the 3.mill. was decorated with bull horns (as we see on many cylinder seals of that time, for example). In my opinion this tradition just went its way through the whole mesopotamian area up to Minoa.
To come to an end, thanks again for this posting. Because of this I found my passion for historical times once more. ;)
As to the "Catal-Minoa"-problem: As alluring as it is to see parallels in the worshipping of bull-like figures, between Catal Huyuk and the first relevant minoan bull figurines lie almost 3000 years. It's highly improbable that the people of Catal just disappered and reappear after so much time. The sign of bull horns was a very popular element in the art of the whole mesopotamian area from the 7. to the 2. millenium b.c. Almost every sumarian temple in the 3.mill. was decorated with bull horns (as we see on many cylinder seals of that time, for example). In my opinion this tradition just went its way through the whole mesopotamian area up to Minoa.
To come to an end, thanks again for this posting. Because of this I found my passion for historical times once more. ;)
By: azuray
