Bush on Sovereignty
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George tries to cover the fact that he doesn't know what 'sovereignty' means...
and fails.
and fails.
Aug 10, 2004 12:01 PM
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
I'm willing to bet that most high school grads could not give a very good definition of sovereignty.
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
Bush graduated from Yale and is President of the United States. He is not your average high-school educated man. At least, he isn't supposed to be...
In the position he is in, one would think he has been exposed to the word "sovereign" at least a hundred times. Why didn't he check a dictionary a long time ago? He could have at least asked his Daddy what it means...
In the position he is in, one would think he has been exposed to the word "sovereign" at least a hundred times. Why didn't he check a dictionary a long time ago? He could have at least asked his Daddy what it means...
By: SkinnyDip485
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
Sorry to be a stickler, but it's "fucking" president. ;)
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
actually, the "fucking" president was Clinton.
Oh man, if you liked that, I have whole collection of chad jokes.
Oh man, if you liked that, I have whole collection of chad jokes.
By: Dango150
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
I'd consider him the 'marital infidelity' president. But of course, killing millions of innocent sperm on a blue dress is certainly worse than killing over 900 American young men without reason.
By: spam_vigilante
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
George Bush did not kill over 900 young men. These young men signed up for a job, and accepted the risk that they might be killed. It's funny that democrats put the guilt trip on George Bush, yet are perfectly okay with abortion. A little side note, for all you FOR abortion. If it was legal when you were born, you might not be here to complain about it today.
By: thedude04
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
It WAS legal when I was born, and I'm still here to complain about it today.
I don't need the damn government to tell me if I can or can't have a baby, thank you kindly. It is MY choice.
I don't need the damn government to tell me if I can or can't have a baby, thank you kindly. It is MY choice.
By: rhoswhen
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
have you ever made out with a vegan as a omnivore? I wish I tasted as good to them.
By: meat
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
Why thank you for your contributions to the discussion. I couldn't help but notice that you're [yet] another member who won't post a link but has a political axe to grind. How very interesting.However, be that as it may, I will share with you that indeed GW Bush is directly responsible for the death of over 900 American soldiers. I will go so far as to enumerate for you:1. WMD. None found. This was supposedly the primary reason Shrub cited for invading the sovereign country with more than 130,000 American troops when fewer than 12,000 were sent to Afghanistan.2. "We will be greeted as liberators." Has this happened? Ask yourself. I don't need to answer for you.3. "Petroleum reserves from that country will pay for their rebuilding effort." Not only hasn't this happened, but in fact we are spending U.S. tax dollars to pay for the local Iraqis to have cheap gasoline imported from Kuwait. This seems like a pretty bad public relations effort by Governor Bush.As for abortion, it is a moral issue and shouldn't be a political one. But those who believe that a supreme being told them to forbid women to control their own reproductive destiny must be right. After all, 79% of anti-abortion activists are men. 100% of them will never get pregnant. Stuff that in your political peace pipe, Einstein.Finally, since Milk and Cookies is a link dump and not a political forum and you've not graced us with so much as a single link (ZERO, ZILCH, NADA), I bid you delightful farewell. This will be my final post to you. You're a troll and deserve no better treatment. In fact, I have been far too kind to your type. Go find a political forum to spew your idiocy.
By: spam_vigilante
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
You seem to have it all figured out-- I can't help but notice that YOU seem to have the political ax to grind. Dose one have to post a link in order to express an opinion??. This thing you wrote here smacks of supreme arrogance.
1) ha ha - intelligent people have different opinions than yours & there's nothing you can do about it.
2) you refer to them as "trolls"
3) you lost your own argument
Go find a political forum to beat your head against the wall
1) ha ha - intelligent people have different opinions than yours & there's nothing you can do about it.
2) you refer to them as "trolls"
3) you lost your own argument
Go find a political forum to beat your head against the wall
By: wacko
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
You don't have to be a democrat to pee on a shrub. You just need an edumucation.
By: teleman
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
If you want to talk hypocrisy, how about the fact that Republicans, who are "pro-life", also believe it's okay to send someone to their death via the electric chair or lethal injection? Isn't the very definition of "pro-life" supposed to mean you support life, period? I'm not arguing, I'm just saying it's useless to stick up for one side and bad mouth the other, because both sides are hypocritical, and both sides are guilty of a lot of shit. Personally, I'm pro-choice, but only in certain instances, and I also support the death penalty.
By: Ryknowcore
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
As Penn and Teller once said on "Bullshit!" pro-life and pro-choice are really stupid PC terms, you are either pro-abortion or anti-abortion. Everyone is pro-life in some instances, no sane person would find it OK to take a flamethrower to a crowd of strangers. By the same rate, everyone is pro-choice in some instances, I don't think anyone would appose your right to chose which shirt you are going to wear today. In order for someone to be anti-abortion and for the death penalty, they might argue that a fetus is alive. And it is not acceptable to kill a fetus because they have never done anything wrong, while a murder has done one of the worst things possible. Personally I find abortion to be wrong, but I can see instances in which it might be necessary. However, if a girl chooses to have a lot of unprotected sex and have multiple abortions, this in my mind is wrong unlike a girl who, let's say, was raped or had some sort of health problem. I mean there's the pill, depro shot, and condoms (while not quite as fun, much more fun than parenthood).
Regarding the question in the video, it reminds me of the old saying "Ask a stupid question, get a stupid answer?" You know, when the primary and general elections come up, I don't think tribal sovereignty will be high up on my list of issues that matter.
Now for the Iraq issue. Actually according to most reports, the number of US soldiers who have died in Iraq is around 3,300 or so, not 900. Now each of these deaths is a tragedy and a great sacrifice on their part and the part of their families so if any of you have lost a loved one you have my sympathies. Also, WMDs have been found in Iraq. Don't believe me, read this pdf:
http://www.foxnews.com/projects/pdf/Iraq_WMD_Declassified.pdf
I know it's from foxnews.com, however the pdf is a copy of the declassified portion of a report to the US House of Represenatives from June 2006 that details the chemical weapons recovered in Iraq that have been there since the time of Desert Storm. But back to blaming Bush for the 900 or 3000 or however many dead American soldiers we have lost in the Iraq War. Someone, I forget who, said Bush was "directly responsible" for those deaths. I didn't know he had the know how to construct and plant a roadside bomb, but I guess I was mistaken. I guess Woodrow Wilson is directly responsible for the over 100,000 dead Americans from World War I, a war started by the assassination of a prince in the Balkans which posed absolutely no threat to the US. By the way, Wilson, a democrat, was elected to the presidency on the platform of US isolationism and promised to keep America out of World War I.
One more thing about the 3,300 dead soldiers in Iraq. What I'm about to say may seem a little calloused and if so I'm sorry, but we seem to like quoting statistics so here we go. We have been fighting in Iraq since 2003 and recently some people on the news have mentioned that we have been in Iraq almost as long as we fought WWII or the Civil War. At any rate, it has taken almost 4 years for us to loose those 3,300 brave men and women. In the American Civil War, the Battle of Cold Harbor in May and June of 1864 to be exact, 7000 men died in the first 20 minutes of fighting. That's twice as many as the entirety of the Iraq War, if you're keeping track.
Regarding the question in the video, it reminds me of the old saying "Ask a stupid question, get a stupid answer?" You know, when the primary and general elections come up, I don't think tribal sovereignty will be high up on my list of issues that matter.
Now for the Iraq issue. Actually according to most reports, the number of US soldiers who have died in Iraq is around 3,300 or so, not 900. Now each of these deaths is a tragedy and a great sacrifice on their part and the part of their families so if any of you have lost a loved one you have my sympathies. Also, WMDs have been found in Iraq. Don't believe me, read this pdf:
http://www.foxnews.com/projects/pdf/Iraq_WMD_Declassified.pdf
I know it's from foxnews.com, however the pdf is a copy of the declassified portion of a report to the US House of Represenatives from June 2006 that details the chemical weapons recovered in Iraq that have been there since the time of Desert Storm. But back to blaming Bush for the 900 or 3000 or however many dead American soldiers we have lost in the Iraq War. Someone, I forget who, said Bush was "directly responsible" for those deaths. I didn't know he had the know how to construct and plant a roadside bomb, but I guess I was mistaken. I guess Woodrow Wilson is directly responsible for the over 100,000 dead Americans from World War I, a war started by the assassination of a prince in the Balkans which posed absolutely no threat to the US. By the way, Wilson, a democrat, was elected to the presidency on the platform of US isolationism and promised to keep America out of World War I.
One more thing about the 3,300 dead soldiers in Iraq. What I'm about to say may seem a little calloused and if so I'm sorry, but we seem to like quoting statistics so here we go. We have been fighting in Iraq since 2003 and recently some people on the news have mentioned that we have been in Iraq almost as long as we fought WWII or the Civil War. At any rate, it has taken almost 4 years for us to loose those 3,300 brave men and women. In the American Civil War, the Battle of Cold Harbor in May and June of 1864 to be exact, 7000 men died in the first 20 minutes of fighting. That's twice as many as the entirety of the Iraq War, if you're keeping track.
By: rickhatman1984
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
If anyone learns anything here today at all, I'd like it if it was this: Over 3000 American soldiers have died in Iraq, not 900. It will top 4000 before we're done.
By: ice-9
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
Yes, yes. he is the freekin president. He deserves our most preverse respect. BOW DOWN HERITICS! KNEEL BEFORE A MAN WHO IS ONLY ALLOWED POWER FOR 8 (max) YEARS!!!!!!!!!
By: meat
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
Ergo, because tribes are sovereign entities we can invade and conquer them as we deem appropriate. Our thinking hasn't changed much in the last 150 years or so.
By: Ragoo
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
I realised while laughing at our communal moron, that I didnt actually know what tribal sovereignty was myself, outside of what the name implies. In researching this apparantly complex subject, I hate to admit that it actually appears as if he is answering the question, not incorrectly, just in general terms. I loathe Bush as much as the next halfway conscious human being, and I cant excuse his inability to think in complex patterns, but in this case, I dont think he was just bullshitting us like he does with everything else. Not to say that any action that world devouring knob gobbler can make, will EVER be 100% bullshit-free.
Wait. Im rantling again. The only reason I posted is that I think this is the best link thumbnail I've ever seen on the front page :D.
Wait. Im rantling again. The only reason I posted is that I think this is the best link thumbnail I've ever seen on the front page :D.
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
Thanks to Dween for the tumbnail, and for most of them over the last several weeks. He's been doing an awesome job. I just haven't found a way to give him credit yet, but I will. ;)
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
I didn't even know we could submit headline thumbnails.
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
What an incredibly odd coincidence, in a number of ways...
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
I love the fact that you can actually hear the panel laughing during his pause.
By: Gone725
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
yes, that was gold.
it may be that the word sovereignty itself is hard to define, but you gotta do a better job than that. the dictionary doesn't include the word it's defining in its definition of that same word for a reason, you get no where with it.
If i tried to define the word 'IS' to someone who didn't know it, i dont say 'well, it is the-....' becuase the person still doesn't know what it means to use the word 'IS'.
I believe as president, if you dont get an above average on the SAT's (and this is without daddys powerful influence) you shouldn't be able to become president. same as the pre-reqs that you were born here, and have lived here for x number of monhs before the election (forgot what x was), and all that ohter stuff, you should be smart enough in general terms to psas the damn SAT like every other highschooler going into college.
it may be that the word sovereignty itself is hard to define, but you gotta do a better job than that. the dictionary doesn't include the word it's defining in its definition of that same word for a reason, you get no where with it.
If i tried to define the word 'IS' to someone who didn't know it, i dont say 'well, it is the-....' becuase the person still doesn't know what it means to use the word 'IS'.
I believe as president, if you dont get an above average on the SAT's (and this is without daddys powerful influence) you shouldn't be able to become president. same as the pre-reqs that you were born here, and have lived here for x number of monhs before the election (forgot what x was), and all that ohter stuff, you should be smart enough in general terms to psas the damn SAT like every other highschooler going into college.
By: Everfalling
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
good grief. what an idiot. this man led the country into a war we didn't and is now trying to "establish sovereignty" in iraq and he doesn't even know what it means. um hellooo... a perfect example is the Indian nation with triebs in arizona, nevada, etc. They are under the rules of the Uinted States government, yet they also have their own tribal rules because they are a nation within a nation. how do we exercise our own rules without conflicting with thier rules, the interviewer wanted to know. incredible.
By: annwithane
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
Bush is such a moron. To think, he went to Yale and does not know what tribal sovereignty is. He should try reading a little bit of information on Andrew Jackson -- the common man -- with whom he is compared to so often. You would think that he has heard of wounded knee, AIM, trail of tears, etc... Christ, we have an idiot for a president; thank god I didn't vote for him. If any of you want more information on Tribal Sovereignty (it is a REAL important issue that lacks recognition because the lack of Native American voice in the political arena) look up the Self Determination Act.
By: damayar
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
Went back and read others' comments after writing my own. Realized that a link to the info for the 1975 Indian Self-Determination Act might be a good thing. Amendments and similarly named items have occurred since then.
Here you go folks:
http://www.answers.com/topic/indian-self-determination-and-education-assistance-act
Here you go folks:
http://www.answers.com/topic/indian-self-determination-and-education-assistance-act
By: catgrin
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
Yep, he's an idiot.
Oh yes, as he knew who he'd be speaking with and to, he should have known this question was coming. He also should have known how to answer. Living in California, I've known for some time what sovereignity is and how it relates to the law. Anyone active in national politics should have known about the issue at hand. It's not so vague a topic as it might sound like.
The easy break down goes like this: The US government deeded land to several american indian nations in restitution for its actions against them. The deeds created sovereign states. This means that on reservation land, the law of the tribal government supercedes American law. Reservation land is like a bunch of mini countries inside the US.
The result of their sovereignity is that actions illegal off reservation land may be legal on res land and vice versa. For example (a very popular one for those complaining about sovereignity), this is why casinos are legal on res land in states that don't allow them. Legally speaking, the casinos aren't inside the state, they're inside property acting as a wholly separate nation in a state with a totally different set of laws. It's also why peyote is legally available to american indians using it for religious purposes on res land, but it cannot be taken off it without fines and jail time, even if you're a full-blooded american indian.
It's because of conflicts between federal (and local and state) law and res law that there's an issue.
Back to the Bush, "Yadda yadda yadda ...therefore the relationship between the federal government tribes is one between sovereign entities..." is basically a rewording of the question he was asked (a standard political "out" when you're stuck for words). If I could discuss this topic without looking anything up, I'm really offended that the man who represents me internationally couldn't.
Oh yes, as he knew who he'd be speaking with and to, he should have known this question was coming. He also should have known how to answer. Living in California, I've known for some time what sovereignity is and how it relates to the law. Anyone active in national politics should have known about the issue at hand. It's not so vague a topic as it might sound like.
The easy break down goes like this: The US government deeded land to several american indian nations in restitution for its actions against them. The deeds created sovereign states. This means that on reservation land, the law of the tribal government supercedes American law. Reservation land is like a bunch of mini countries inside the US.
The result of their sovereignity is that actions illegal off reservation land may be legal on res land and vice versa. For example (a very popular one for those complaining about sovereignity), this is why casinos are legal on res land in states that don't allow them. Legally speaking, the casinos aren't inside the state, they're inside property acting as a wholly separate nation in a state with a totally different set of laws. It's also why peyote is legally available to american indians using it for religious purposes on res land, but it cannot be taken off it without fines and jail time, even if you're a full-blooded american indian.
It's because of conflicts between federal (and local and state) law and res law that there's an issue.
Back to the Bush, "Yadda yadda yadda ...therefore the relationship between the federal government tribes is one between sovereign entities..." is basically a rewording of the question he was asked (a standard political "out" when you're stuck for words). If I could discuss this topic without looking anything up, I'm really offended that the man who represents me internationally couldn't.
By: catgrin
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
I want to make mention,Bush made a pretty clear statement about sovgnernabilty. clearly, one could speculate the justatotalidge of the mastication. and the AV for this confrence really didnt ring out the mics properly. a clusterfuck in all.
By: meat
Re: Bush on Sovereignty
I am a sovereign entity, bush. I am a sovereign entity. trust me. and give me my sovereign entity rights. it will help your poll rating! :) put your john hancock on it and we will call it good.
By: meat